Towards rc2

Post by Pavel Sanda
hi,
i would like to release rc2 next monday (28. march).
soft freeze should should come around thursday.
few days after release i would like to freeze strings for 2.0.
anyone have a spare time to look on the crash #7345 ?

I did it already. AFAICS, the selection starting in text mode
causes to open the context-edit menu but the fact the right
click happened inside the math is not considered anywhere.
Therefor the translated cursor position has no paragraph and
the crash happens. I propose (again) to check for text mode
and add a FIXME to care for the correct context menu later.

Stephan

Pavel Sanda

2011-03-19 11:38:43 UTC

Post by Stephan Witt
the crash happens. I propose (again) to check for text mode
and add a FIXME to care for the correct context menu later.

do you have a patch?
pavel

Stephan Witt

2011-03-19 11:50:25 UTC

Post by Stephan Witt
the crash happens. I propose (again) to check for text mode
and add a FIXME to care for the correct context menu later.

do you have a patch?

That would be easy. But perhaps Vincent has a better proposal.

Stephan

Vincent van Ravesteijn

2011-03-19 11:41:16 UTC

Post by Stephan Witt

The context-edit menu is the correct menu.

Did you read my comment in the bugreport ?

Vincent

Stephan Witt

2011-03-19 11:48:29 UTC

Post by Vincent van Ravesteijn

Post by Stephan Witt

The context-edit menu is the correct menu.

Yes. Because of the selection...

Post by Vincent van Ravesteijn
Did you read my comment in the bugreport ?

Yes, that's why I said "add a FIXME".

I think it makes no sense to crash in expandSpellingSuggestions
if it is possible to care for the correct text mode.

It's really hard to decide if the call to expandSpellingSuggestions
should happen with selections or if it better should be avoided.
If a word is selected the call is correct, if the selection spans
non-text insets it is not. Why not let it expandSpellingSuggestions
decide?

Stephan

Edwin Leuven

2011-03-19 12:26:01 UTC

and put in the oxygen icons and new toolbar layout?

--
http://leuven.economists.nl

Pavel Sanda

2011-03-19 12:32:18 UTC

Post by Edwin Leuven
and put in the oxygen icons and new toolbar layout?

there seemed to be more voices for new libre office icons.
you have disappeared from list without sharing the binaries
so the whole topic went asleep.

there is still one week to finish it (after rc2 i would
like to freeze ui).

pavel

Jürgen Spitzmüller

2011-03-19 12:35:50 UTC

Post by Pavel Sanda
there seemed to be more voices for new libre office icons.
you have disappeared from list without sharing the binaries
so the whole topic went asleep.
there is still one week to finish it (after rc2 i would
like to freeze ui).

However you decide, you should decide now. The new icons (even more so a
toolbar change) need to be considered in the manuals. So we need some time
after this change.

Jürgen

Pavel Sanda

2011-03-19 15:22:02 UTC

However you decide, you should decide now. The new icons (even more so a
toolbar change) need to be considered in the manuals. So we need some time
after this change.

soft freeze is on thursday and as usual docs can go even in later days.
iirc there was no consesus so its clear what would be my decision right now.

Edwin, you renounced the set you proposed in favour of oxygen?

pavel

Edwin Leuven

2011-03-19 15:38:11 UTC

i did not manage to find the svg sources, and don't have the time to
fi ish this on my own

imo we should give lyx a facelift with the oxygen icons and i also
think rob's new toolbar layout is a good idea

ed.

However you decide, you should decide now. The new icons (even more so a
toolbar change) need to be considered in the manuals. So we need some time
after this change.

soft freeze is on thursday and as usual docs can go even in later days.
iirc there was no consesus so its clear what would be my decision right now.
Edwin, you renounced the set you proposed in favour of oxygen?
pavel

--
http://leuven.economists.nl

Pavel Sanda

2011-03-19 15:54:27 UTC

Post by Edwin Leuven
i did not manage to find the svg sources, and don't have the time to
fi ish this on my own
imo we should give lyx a facelift with the oxygen icons and i also
think rob's new toolbar layout is a good idea

ok, so at this moment we know the new default is going to be oxygen.

next two related things to decide:
1. new layout was proposed by Rob. who agrees/disagrees with this?

2. some people won't be happy with icons change and there was proposal
from me and supported by Enrico that we should allow to use older
icons and in the same manner have prepared API in case somebody wants
to add other sets like tango/libre office/windows standard/whatsoever.

except Joost, how many people are against this?

pavel

Jürgen Spitzmüller

2011-03-19 16:03:41 UTC

Post by Pavel Sanda
1. new layout was proposed by Rob. who agrees/disagrees with this?

I think it needs very careful auditing with regard to different workflow
scenarios. This has not happened yet, so I am against putting it in now.

Post by Pavel Sanda
2. some people won't be happy with icons change and there was proposal
from me and supported by Enrico that we should allow to use older
icons and in the same manner have prepared API in case somebody wants
to add other sets like tango/libre office/windows standard/whatsoever.
except Joost, how many people are against this?

Me. This will end up like the "classic.ui" thing which is more or less
unmaintained.

I propose we provide alternative icon sets via the wiki (but not ship it).

Jürgen

Pavel Sanda

2011-03-19 16:28:57 UTC

Post by Pavel Sanda
1. new layout was proposed by Rob. who agrees/disagrees with this?

I think it needs very careful auditing with regard to different workflow
scenarios. This has not happened yet, so I am against putting it in now.

now means "right now" or for 2.0?

what you mean by auditing? you must perfectly know that there was never any deep
auditing of LyX UI and we have no ui professionals among devs - this is effectively
equivalent to saying no ;)

next point to consider is that if there are plans to change UI we should ship
it as one big change instead of requiring users to learn new UI changes in each
release cycle.

pavel

Jürgen Spitzmüller

2011-03-19 16:41:39 UTC

Post by Pavel Sanda
now means "right now" or for 2.0?

For 2.0.

Post by Pavel Sanda
what you mean by auditing? you must perfectly know that there was never any
deep auditing of LyX UI and we have no ui professionals among devs - this
is effectively equivalent to saying no ;)

IMHO this comes too late for 2.0. UI change is a very sensitive process,
especially if elements shall be removed from the toolbars. The flame wars we
usually have are not only because we are no UI experts, but also because work
flows differ.

A substantial change like this is nothing that should be done in the RC phase,
IMO.

Post by Pavel Sanda
next point to consider is that if there are plans to change UI we should
ship it as one big change instead of requiring users to learn new UI
changes in each release cycle.

I think the icon changes and a reorganization of the toolbars could well be
introduced subsequently. The icons do not change the UI structure.

Jürgen

Georg Baum

2011-03-20 11:26:10 UTC

Post by Pavel Sanda
1. new layout was proposed by Rob. who agrees/disagrees with this?

I think it needs very careful auditing with regard to different workflow
scenarios. This has not happened yet, so I am against putting it in now.

While I personally like the new toolbars much better I agree that it is
better to postpone this change to 2.1. "Release candidate" should mean "this
will become the released version, unless a critical bug needs to be fixed".

Me. This will end up like the "classic.ui" thing which is more or less
unmaintained.

If that is really the case they could be removed again. I liked the idea of
treating them like translations: If an icon set is too incomplete it gets
removed. As long as Pavel and Enrico maintain the alternative sets and
nobody else is required to put any work into them it is fine IMHO.

Post by JÃ¼rgen SpitzmÃ¼ller
I propose we provide alternative icon sets via the wiki (but not ship it).

BTW, I would have preferred the libre office icons, but anything is better
than the current ones.

Georg

Pavel Sanda

2011-03-20 13:44:40 UTC

Post by Georg Baum

Post by JÃ¼rgen SpitzmÃ¼ller
Me. This will end up like the "classic.ui" thing which is more or less
unmaintained.

Post by JÃ¼rgen SpitzmÃ¼ller
I propose we provide alternative icon sets via the wiki (but not ship it).

BTW, I would have preferred the libre office icons, but anything is better
than the current ones.

Edwin, can you share the current state of art of libre office icons?
i dont remember how much remained to be done.

pavel

Edwin Leuven

2011-03-20 13:58:38 UTC

Post by Pavel Sanda
Edwin, can you share the current state of art of libre office icons?
i dont remember how much remained to be done.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/359550/images.zip

ed.

Edwin Leuven

2011-03-20 15:12:53 UTC

Post by Georg Baum
I personally like the new toolbars much better

1. my guess is that most of us like it much better

2. moreover, doing it now will give us real feedback to tweak it

3. we don't need major releases to update the toolbar layout

4. and 2.0 introduces many new features so timing is optimal

imo, 4 good reasons to go for it now

ed.

Joost Verburg

2011-03-20 15:22:40 UTC

Post by Edwin Leuven
imo, 4 good reasons to go for it now

I agree. Updating the icons and toolbar together makes much more sense.
If we put it in now, there's enough time left for fine tuning.

Joost

Abdelrazak Younes

2011-03-20 15:26:12 UTC

Post by Edwin Leuven
imo, 4 good reasons to go for it now

I agree. Updating the icons and toolbar together makes much more sense.
If we put it in now, there's enough time left for fine tuning.

And I say: having sufficient developers (I count 4 or 5) for it is
sufficient reason to put it in :-)

That it has my vote as well.
Abdel.

Stephan Witt

2011-03-20 16:27:53 UTC

Post by Edwin Leuven
imo, 4 good reasons to go for it now

I agree. Updating the icons and toolbar together makes much more sense.
If we put it in now, there's enough time left for fine tuning.

And I say: having sufficient developers (I count 4 or 5) for it is sufficient reason to put it in :-)
That it has my vote as well.

My vote too. I'll happily test it on mac.

Stephan

Pavel Sanda

2011-03-20 15:30:45 UTC

Post by Edwin Leuven
imo, 4 good reasons to go for it now

I agree. Updating the icons and toolbar together makes much more sense.
If we put it in now, there's enough time left for fine tuning.

i'm somewhat inclined to this as well, no strong opinion though.

can somebody post list of layout changes so we can see whether there
is consensus about them?

pavel

Rob Oakes

2011-03-20 15:49:21 UTC

Post by Pavel Sanda
can somebody post list of layout changes so we can see whether there
is consensus about them?

Here is the toolbars file I put together (or, at least the one I use).

This post from the original UI discussion has the rationale for the layout:

http://www.mail-archive.com/lyx-***@lists.lyx.org/msg165984.html

Cheers,

Rob

.

Pavel Sanda

2011-03-20 16:04:18 UTC

Post by Rob Oakes

Post by Pavel Sanda
can somebody post list of layout changes so we can see whether there
is consensus about them?

Here is the toolbars file I put together (or, at least the one I use).

i meant list of changes or screenshot, so we have it at this place.
pavel

Jürgen Spitzmüller

2011-03-20 17:51:14 UTC

Post by Rob Oakes

Post by Pavel Sanda
can somebody post list of layout changes so we can see whether there
is consensus about them?

Here is the toolbars file I put together (or, at least the one I use).

This toolbar misses master-buffer-view and master-buffer-update, which is a
very crucial feature for me.

I didn't check further.

Jürgen

Joost Verburg

2011-03-20 14:15:12 UTC

Post by Pavel Sanda
ok, so at this moment we know the new default is going to be oxygen.

Should I upload the new icons?

Joost

Pavel Sanda

2011-03-20 15:27:48 UTC

Post by Pavel Sanda
ok, so at this moment we know the new default is going to be oxygen.

Should I upload the new icons?

the question is about location in the tree if we are going to have
more sets. i'm little bit waiting on Enrico's input.

pavel

Enrico Forestieri

2011-03-20 23:15:01 UTC

Post by Pavel Sanda
ok, so at this moment we know the new default is going to be oxygen.

Should I upload the new icons?

the question is about location in the tree if we are going to have
more sets. i'm little bit waiting on Enrico's input.

Well, I disagree on both the move to 22x22 standard size and the new
proposed icons. As it seems everyone else is fine with both issues, I will
arrange to have my personal copy with 20x20 icons whose look is as in the
attached image (obtained with a patch setting normalIconSize = 20).
So, I don't think I can contribute to this aspect as I already did my own
personal fork :)

--
Enrico

Enrico Forestieri

2011-03-20 23:23:29 UTC

Post by Enrico Forestieri
Well, I disagree on both the move to 22x22 standard size and the new
proposed icons. As it seems everyone else is fine with both issues, I will
arrange to have my personal copy with 20x20 icons whose look is as in the
attached image (obtained with a patch setting normalIconSize = 20).
So, I don't think I can contribute to this aspect as I already did my own
personal fork :)

Thinking a bit more about it, maybe the code could be arranged such that
to not have hardcoded the normal size. Say we look at the size of a
particular icon and then set normalIconSize according to its size. In this
way, an icon set can also decide what the normal size is and maybe
everyone is happy...

--
Enrico

Julien Rioux

2011-03-22 21:08:11 UTC

Post by Pavel Sanda
1. new layout was proposed by Rob. who agrees/disagrees with this?
2. some people won't be happy with icons change and there was proposal
from me and supported by Enrico that we should allow to use older
icons and in the same manner have prepared API in case somebody wants
to add other sets like tango/libre office/windows standard/whatsoever.

From my humble point of view, both are great additions. However I
cannot help with the process so it is only an opinion (I know words are
cheap but I have no code!)

--
Julien

Vincent van Ravesteijn

2011-03-19 12:41:51 UTC